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Joe’s polling was in the toilet — but he still thinks he would have won…

During an interview with USA Today this week, outgoing President Joe Biden was asked if he thought he could have beaten President-elect Donald Trump if the swap for Kamala Harris never happened.

“Do you believe you could have won in November?” asked USA Today Washington Bureau Chief Susan Page during their recent sitdown.

“It’s presumptuous to say that, but I think yes, based on the polling that…” Biden began to answer before Page jumped in with a follow-up.

“Do you think you would’ve had the vigor to serve another four years in office?” she also asked.

“I don’t know,” Biden admitted. “That’s why I thought when I first announced, talking to Barack about it, I said I thought I was the person. I had no intention of running after Beau died – for real, not a joke. And then when Trump was running again for reelection, I really thought I had the best chance of beating him. But I also wasn’t looking to be president when I was 85 years old, 86 years old. And so I did talk about passing the baton. But I don’t know. Who the hell knows? So far, so good. But who knows what I’m going to be when I’m 86 years old?”

Biden was forced out of the 2024 presidential race by his own party and top Democrats like former House Speaker Nancy Pelosi after his disastrous first debate against Donald Trump when it became obvious to the nation he was struggling from cognitive decline.

Page also asked Biden about preemptive pardons for Liz Cheney and Anthony Fauci. Transcript below:

PAGE: Mr. President, your term is not over yet. You’re still doing things every day. Some of your supporters have encouraged you to issue preemptive pardons to people like Liz Cheney and Anthony Fauci, who Trump has threatened to target. Will you do that?

BIDEN: Well, a little bit of it depends on who he puts in what positions. If in fact, he… Here’s how… I was very straightforward with Trump when he got elected. I invited him immediately to  the White House. I spent two hours with him. He talked about, he was very complimentary about some of the economic things I had done. And he talked about −he thought I was leaving with a good record, kind of thing. I tried to make it clear that there was no need, and it was counterintuitive for his interest to go back and try to settle scores.

PAGE: And did he give you an answer on what he was going to do?

BIDEN: Well, he didn’t. But he didn’t say, “No, I’m going to…” You know. He didn’t reinforce it. He just basically listened. And…

PAGE: So you haven’t decided yet. You’re still assessing this issue?

BIDEN: Well, no, I have not. For example, I think there are certain people like, if he were to, I don’t want to name their names. I’ll tell you off the record. [REDACTED]. But there are other parties that we’re following through on to determine that, rectifying some of the, correcting powder-cocaine difference, things like that.

PAGE: More traditional kind of pardons.

BIDEN: Yeah.

More over at USA Today: